Comments on: Graduation rates in need of resuscitation http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/ Parenting, Politics and News for the Perfectly Challenged Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:03:54 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6 By: Allison J http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152420 Allison J Wed, 02 Apr 2008 21:15:52 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152420 [quote comment="152416"] And that right there is a much, MUCH bigger and more valid point than simply "We're poor and we're black. Why try?"[/quote] I don't think anyone is buying "We're poor and we're black" as an excuse any more than "I'm white and I deserve it." [quote comment="152416"]
And that right there is a much, MUCH bigger and more valid point than simply “We’re poor and we’re black. Why try?”[/quote]

I don’t think anyone is buying “We’re poor and we’re black” as an excuse any more than “I’m white and I deserve it.”

]]> By: Allison http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152416 Allison Wed, 02 Apr 2008 21:04:29 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152416 [quote comment="152407"]I think it has everything to do with how involved the parents are. I really think it's that simple.[/quote] And that right there is a much, MUCH bigger and more valid point than simply "We're poor and we're black. Why try?" [quote comment="152407"]I think it has everything to do with how involved the parents are. I really think it’s that simple.[/quote]

And that right there is a much, MUCH bigger and more valid point than simply “We’re poor and we’re black. Why try?”

]]> By: Rita http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152414 Rita Wed, 02 Apr 2008 20:54:38 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152414 [quote comment="152401"]This is a little off topic, but seems like a good place to point out that we have a little widget that highlights/shades a comment if it is being made by the post's author (As you can see on Allison J's comments above). It's probably not foolproof, but should work enough of the time to help try and keep things clear as to who's who...[/quote] Very cool. Thanks for pointing that out. I'm a little slow on the uptake you know. [quote comment="152401"]This is a little off topic, but seems like a good place to point out that we have a little widget that highlights/shades a comment if it is being made by the post’s author (As you can see on Allison J’s comments above). It’s probably not foolproof, but should work enough of the time to help try and keep things clear as to who’s who…[/quote]

Very cool. Thanks for pointing that out. I’m a little slow on the uptake you know.

]]> By: Rita http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152413 Rita Wed, 02 Apr 2008 20:53:06 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152413 Parental involvement is huge. It is probably the biggest factor alone. But, the reality is that parents who are involved and care about their kids and their education, regardless of race or occupation, are NOT going to be living downtown Detroit by the time their kids are in high school. And, if they are especially down on their luck and haven't been able to move out of the inner-city districts or send their kids to private schools, well then they're the 24% who DO graduate. There are so many, many factors that go into these numbers. But, the bottom line is, in those particular cities, you're looking mostly at parents who aren't involved, who don't care, who probably have legal or chemical dependency issues of their own on top of race and poverty. I'm not saying just write them off. I'm just saying that with our world the way it is today, these numbers are not all that surprising. Parental involvement is huge. It is probably the biggest factor alone. But, the reality is that parents who are involved and care about their kids and their education, regardless of race or occupation, are NOT going to be living downtown Detroit by the time their kids are in high school. And, if they are especially down on their luck and haven’t been able to move out of the inner-city districts or send their kids to private schools, well then they’re the 24% who DO graduate. There are so many, many factors that go into these numbers. But, the bottom line is, in those particular cities, you’re looking mostly at parents who aren’t involved, who don’t care, who probably have legal or chemical dependency issues of their own on top of race and poverty.

I’m not saying just write them off. I’m just saying that with our world the way it is today, these numbers are not all that surprising.

]]> By: Jessica http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152407 Jessica Wed, 02 Apr 2008 20:37:23 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152407 I think it has everything to do with how involved the parents are. I really think it's that simple. I think it has everything to do with how involved the parents are. I really think it’s that simple.

]]> By: Allison J http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152405 Allison J Wed, 02 Apr 2008 20:31:51 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152405 [quote comment="152402"]My point is that race should not make a difference in graduation rates. Is pure laziness an inherent gene in minorities? No. That's absurd. So coming from 'the hood' should not be a stigma for these youth. If black or hispanic kids really want to get one up on 'the man', then they should hit the books, get a higher education, and an acquire positions where they can make a difference. Lack of funds does not equate lack of intelligence. And 'we' should not just sit back and say "Well, they come from urban areas with high minority concentrations. That's why the dropout rate is high. It's for different reasons if it happens in the suburbs." And Allison J, you're right, it's not solely the responsibility of educators to see that they graduate, they should know how to make the right decision of finishing school, so as to not become a societal leeches. Race nor income level should be deciding factors in an individual's potential.[/quote] I hear where you are coming from, I really do. But you also have to think about where some of these kids are coming from -- what they see, what is thrown onto them. You have children living in poverty, children with little to eat, children who have to look after other siblings. There may be drugs in the home, abuse, etc. Also, as I stated before, I do not know how many are working towards their GED or left to pursue other potentially lucrative and rewarding careers. I don't think it's as easy as saying "buck up! hit the books and make your way." With that said, I'm sure some of these kids are just plain lazy. But a lot of these children are in unfortunate situations. They may come from horrific homes, or no home at all. I'm not being naive, this isn't always the case, nor is it an excuse. But there is a real problem here, and it isn't as simple as hitting the books. [quote comment="152402"]My point is that race should not make a difference in graduation rates.
Is pure laziness an inherent gene in minorities? No. That’s absurd.
So coming from ‘the hood’ should not be a stigma for these youth. If black or hispanic kids really want to get one up on ‘the man’, then they should hit the books, get a higher education, and an acquire positions where they can make a difference.
Lack of funds does not equate lack of intelligence.
And ‘we’ should not just sit back and say “Well, they come from urban areas with high minority concentrations. That’s why the dropout rate is high. It’s for different reasons if it happens in the suburbs.”
And Allison J, you’re right, it’s not solely the responsibility of educators to see that they graduate, they should know how to make the right decision of finishing school, so as to not become a societal leeches.
Race nor income level should be deciding factors in an individual’s potential.[/quote]

I hear where you are coming from, I really do. But you also have to think about where some of these kids are coming from — what they see, what is thrown onto them.

You have children living in poverty, children with little to eat, children who have to look after other siblings. There may be drugs in the home, abuse, etc.

Also, as I stated before, I do not know how many are working towards their GED or left to pursue other potentially lucrative and rewarding careers.

I don’t think it’s as easy as saying “buck up! hit the books and make your way.” With that said, I’m sure some of these kids are just plain lazy. But a lot of these children are in unfortunate situations. They may come from horrific homes, or no home at all. I’m not being naive, this isn’t always the case, nor is it an excuse. But there is a real problem here, and it isn’t as simple as hitting the books.

]]> By: Allison http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152402 Allison Wed, 02 Apr 2008 20:19:52 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152402 My point is that race should not make a difference in graduation rates. Is pure laziness an inherent gene in minorities? No. That's absurd. So coming from 'the hood' should not be a stigma for these youth. If black or hispanic kids really want to get one up on 'the man', then they should hit the books, get a higher education, and an acquire positions where they can make a difference. Lack of funds does not equate lack of intelligence. And 'we' should not just sit back and say "Well, they come from urban areas with high minority concentrations. That's why the dropout rate is high. It's for different reasons if it happens in the suburbs." And Allison J, you're right, it's not solely the responsibility of educators to see that they graduate, they should know how to make the right decision of finishing school, so as to not become a societal leeches. Race nor income level should be deciding factors in an individual's potential. My point is that race should not make a difference in graduation rates.
Is pure laziness an inherent gene in minorities? No. That’s absurd.
So coming from ‘the hood’ should not be a stigma for these youth. If black or hispanic kids really want to get one up on ‘the man’, then they should hit the books, get a higher education, and an acquire positions where they can make a difference.
Lack of funds does not equate lack of intelligence.
And ‘we’ should not just sit back and say “Well, they come from urban areas with high minority concentrations. That’s why the dropout rate is high. It’s for different reasons if it happens in the suburbs.”
And Allison J, you’re right, it’s not solely the responsibility of educators to see that they graduate, they should know how to make the right decision of finishing school, so as to not become a societal leeches.
Race nor income level should be deciding factors in an individual’s potential.

]]> By: IP staff http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152401 IP staff Wed, 02 Apr 2008 20:19:18 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152401 This is a little off topic, but seems like a good place to point out that we have a little widget that highlights/shades a comment if it is being made by the post's author (As you can see on Allison J's comments above). It's probably not foolproof, but should work enough of the time to help try and keep things clear as to who's who... This is a little off topic, but seems like a good place to point out that we have a little widget that highlights/shades a comment if it is being made by the post’s author (As you can see on Allison J’s comments above). It’s probably not foolproof, but should work enough of the time to help try and keep things clear as to who’s who…

]]> By: Allison J http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152388 Allison J Wed, 02 Apr 2008 19:47:46 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152388 I had actually thought of social work as a career, then decided it would be too heart-breaking -- knowing there is so much to be done with so few resources and enforcement. I applaud those in the field. It's sad to see that sometimes the same is true in education. I had actually thought of social work as a career, then decided it would be too heart-breaking — knowing there is so much to be done with so few resources and enforcement. I applaud those in the field.

It’s sad to see that sometimes the same is true in education.

]]> By: Rita http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152386 Rita Wed, 02 Apr 2008 19:44:21 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152386 [quote comment="152376"] As a young teacher I rack my brain for solutions -- but it goes way beyond educators alone.[/quote] Yeah, there's only so much you can do. I know how frustrating it is to be in a situation that's limiting your ability. I practiced social work in Texas. Talk about a losing battle. Parents of my clients would ask me what I would do if one of my kids had special needs and my immediate response was, "Move." It's hard to want to make a difference when you're in an area where change is considered hopeless. [quote comment="152376"]
As a young teacher I rack my brain for solutions — but it goes way beyond educators alone.[/quote]

Yeah, there’s only so much you can do. I know how frustrating it is to be in a situation that’s limiting your ability. I practiced social work in Texas. Talk about a losing battle. Parents of my clients would ask me what I would do if one of my kids had special needs and my immediate response was, “Move.” It’s hard to want to make a difference when you’re in an area where change is considered hopeless.

]]> By: Allison J http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152376 Allison J Wed, 02 Apr 2008 19:31:12 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152376 No prob Rita. Race is a huge issue in relation to success in school. And I disagree with Allison (no J), for insinuating that race has little to do with drop-out rates in high school. Allison (no J) -- The ten schools with the lowest graduation rates are major cities -- and within major cities are a more diverse population of people. Take a look at the links provided by Rita -- the correlations are there. Unfortunately, many of those living below poverty, and those who fail to graduate hs or achieve any post-hs education, are non-caucasian. As a young teacher I rack my brain for solutions -- but it goes way beyond educators alone. No prob Rita.

Race is a huge issue in relation to success in school. And I disagree with Allison (no J), for insinuating that race has little to do with drop-out rates in high school.

Allison (no J) — The ten schools with the lowest graduation rates are major cities — and within major cities are a more diverse population of people. Take a look at the links provided by Rita — the correlations are there.

Unfortunately, many of those living below poverty, and those who fail to graduate hs or achieve any post-hs education, are non-caucasian.

As a young teacher I rack my brain for solutions — but it goes way beyond educators alone.

]]> By: Rita http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152372 Rita Wed, 02 Apr 2008 19:23:42 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152372 Ah, I stand corrected, thankfully, because it's hard to imagine that an educator would be unaware of the myriad of issues surrounding race and success in school. Please accept my apology for the mistake. Ah, I stand corrected, thankfully, because it’s hard to imagine that an educator would be unaware of the myriad of issues surrounding race and success in school. Please accept my apology for the mistake.

]]> By: Allison J http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152364 Allison J Wed, 02 Apr 2008 18:53:45 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152364 Rita, I'm not the one who made the comment about race -- Allison, no J, did Rita, I’m not the one who made the comment about race —
Allison, no J, did

]]> By: Rita http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152359 Rita Wed, 02 Apr 2008 18:24:16 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152359 Oh, that second link was the same as the first, here's what was supposed to be the second: http://www.childtrendsdatabank.org/indicators/1highschooldropout.cfm Oh, that second link was the same as the first, here’s what was supposed to be the second:

http://www.childtrendsdatabank.org/indicators/1highschooldropout.cfm

]]> By: Rita http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152357 Rita Wed, 02 Apr 2008 18:22:42 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152357 You can just do a Google search and come up with tons of information about race and drop out rates. Here are just a few to get started on: http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0779196.html http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0779196.html http://www.diverseeducation.com/artman/publish/article_7317.shtml What do you teach again? You can just do a Google search and come up with tons of information about race and drop out rates. Here are just a few to get started on:

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0779196.html

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0779196.html

http://www.diverseeducation.com/artman/publish/article_7317.shtml

What do you teach again?

]]> By: Rita http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152354 Rita Wed, 02 Apr 2008 18:17:22 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152354 It actually has a lot to do with it. It actually has a lot to do with it.

]]> By: Allison http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152278 Allison Wed, 02 Apr 2008 15:30:51 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152278 What the hell does the race of a city have to do with drop-out rates? Man, I get really tired of hearing that. What the hell does the race of a city have to do with drop-out rates? Man, I get really tired of hearing that.

]]> By: Rita http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152086 Rita Tue, 01 Apr 2008 23:54:42 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152086 That said, I actually dropped out of high school. The summer before my senior year. I worked that year that would have been my senior year and took my GED and went on to junior college, then to college. But, the areas that are listed in the above don't seem to be like my situation. The top 5 are predominantly black cities. Then there's Minneapolis, which is still predominantly white, then the ones after that are mixed race (black, white and hispanic). That said, I actually dropped out of high school. The summer before my senior year. I worked that year that would have been my senior year and took my GED and went on to junior college, then to college. But, the areas that are listed in the above don’t seem to be like my situation. The top 5 are predominantly black cities. Then there’s Minneapolis, which is still predominantly white, then the ones after that are mixed race (black, white and hispanic).

]]> By: Allison J http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152066 Allison J Tue, 01 Apr 2008 22:54:37 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152066 Ya think? Push, push, push 'em through -- at least until they are old enough to drop out. Ya think?

Push, push, push ‘em through — at least until they are old enough to drop out.

]]> By: Rita http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152062 Rita Tue, 01 Apr 2008 22:48:36 +0000 http://blog.imperfectparent.com/2008/04/01/graduation-rates-in-need-of-resuscitation/#comment-152062 Oh, are there children being left behind? Oh, are there children being left behind?

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